New Hall?

[Khunlin]

We had a discussion on this a while back... but it never came to anything!

I know our hall is beautiful/classic etc... but from a GvG point of view, I hate it! Splitting is awkward... flagstand is claustrophobic... there's a damned catapult!

What are your thoughts on picking a new hall that is both pretty and strategically interesting?

A few of the "prettier" halls, regardless of the strategic considerations:
Uncharted Isle
Isle of Solitude
Isle of Meditation
Frozen Isle
Imperial Isle

[mura]

I liked the Isle of the Dead quite a lot myself. Always thought it'd be fun to GvG in as well.

But Cathan halls are all nice too---so I don't mind as long as its in that range.

[Triia]

I wouldn't be opposed to trying out something new. I haven't checked lately but sigils are probably still fairly cheap. We could even try more than one if that's still the case.

As far as aesthetics, I kind of like Uncharted Isle and maybe the Isle of Meditation (haven't run around there in quite some time other than frantic PvP pace). Now, aesthetics are important to me (I wouldn't care if it was the strategically the best hall out there, I'd never want the Isle of Jade... bleh... ) but I'd like to pick something that really plays to our strength too, which is... is... umm... yeah, that's not my department. *looks for Khunlin*

[Khunlin]

Hehehe... I don't really know what our strengths are. My guess at the moment is that we have strong players, but we're a bit lacking in the teamwork department. In that case, a split build would exploit our individual strength rather than teamwork. All of the above halls (except Imperial) are split halls, Frozen being the best for that.

[Liadan]

I'd vote myself for Frozen - but that's mostly on tactics. >.> Which is why XXX has an ugly hall. I insisted on it. <.<

[Khunlin]

My favourite would be Frozen, but we have to take aesthetics into consideration or Triia will go on a mad rampage and boot everyone from the guild. She might even swear at a kitten while she does it.

But, here's my proposal: how about we rent Frozen Isle for a weekend, try out the split, and if we like the split build/playstyle, we can pick a nicer looking but slightly less split-happy hall? Or I can rely on our laziness to push back the getting of the new hall indefinitely and we end up on Frozen?

[Jupiter]

I was all for a new hall about a year ago but when we didn't go forward with it and sigils went back up in price I sold mine.
I'm ok with tactically sound and less pretty halls, but I refuse to go to something hideous...no pulsating guild halls for me!
Can we meet up for a tour and discussion of the top few sometime soon?

[Liadan]

Burning doesn't pulsate... at least I hope not...

khunlinicewind said:

My favourite would be Frozen, but we have to take aesthetics into consideration or Triia will go on a mad rampage and boot everyone from the guild. She might even swear at a kitten while she does it.

But, here's my proposal: how about we rent Frozen Isle for a weekend, try out the split, and if we like the split build/playstyle, we can pick a nicer looking but slightly less split-happy hall? Or I can rely on our laziness to push back the getting of the new hall indefinitely and we end up on Frozen?

The first is giving me a funny image that's making me giggle for quite a bit. For the second... don't count me for the "pretty" hall tour, but I'll be willing to come play on the split build, if need be.

[Kaiser]

And here I was just now thinking...ANYTHING BUT FROZEN!!!

I abhor that map. Yes it is split-tastic, but all of our most memorable losses have happened there, and the ice...well, I hate the ice. I would be ok in either of the Elonan maps, but the Canthan maps give me pause. I like how splits can work in the Shing Jea arena with the 2 stands, but I don't like how it can work against us. The acid traps on the way to the flag in Imperial make me cringe. It is the most wide open of any hall though, and that can be to our advantage, especially if we start to use more ranged attacks in GvG.

Just, please, not Frozen...

EDIT: I already have a Sigil. So there's no need to buy one. But because it is mine, I get to rule out Frozen...tabun.

[Triia]

Thank you Kaiser, I just didn't want to say it. I'm not really all that fond of Frozen either. I really hate that ice effect.

I'm still fond of Uncharted and Isle of Meditation. I seem to remember there being both open and the occasional tight spot on both of those. I'll have to pay them both a visit.

And... pulsating halls? WTF!? There are halls that PULSATE!?!




Also... for the record... I NEVER swear at kittens.

[Khunlin]

Bleh, ice is annoying if we get stuck/kd'ed on it... but just imagine how much we can piss them off? Five KD's? Please. And... I don't like "we always lose on it" as a reason not to play it... because that most likely means we need to practice it.

However... if there is firm opposition to it, I may be swayed. I would like to run that hall for one weekend, perhaps, simply because it is the single godliest split hall on the face of the earth. I'll even pay for the sigil. If we like the splitting and the build is sufficiently dealage, then perhaps we can switch to Uncharted/Meditation... slightly less badass... but...

But anyway, keep in mind the other halls. (Not Isle of Jade.) Druid's, anyone?


But, really... the reasons I dislike Wizard's:
-Flagstand is very close-quartered... AoE hurts us muchly, and it's very difficult as a monk to keep an eye on the enemy warriors when everyone is standing on eachother's shoulders.
-Splitting is awkward. Guild thieves ftl... not to mention it's easy to see when the other team sends off a split.
-Catapults. Suck. Seriously, guys... how many times have we turtled, started wearing them down and pushing them back to the stand, only to be caught in the cata field and have to run back to the Lord? Once you turtle on this map... you're done. You can't push back.
-On offensive pushes... how often do we get stuck without the thief? Too often. And long enough for them to get a base res of whoever we killed. This usually doesn't go well for us. No thief Halls FTW, in my opinion.

[Liadan]

On a side note, if anyone picks either Isle of Jade or Weeping Stone for their first choice, I may have to murder a small, innocent, cute kitten.

As for switching halls - I agree with Khunlin here. I dislike GvGing on Wizard's, Hunter's, and Warrior's (I think those were the three that're pretty much identical), no matter how pretty they are. Druid's is what XXX used to have. I don't have any severe objections to it, but really, if you're going for a split hall... may as well go for something else, no? I still would suggest Frozen, with Meditation and Solitude as poor alternatives.

I'm not sure I understand what all the objection is about the ice. Yes, it's annoying, but in an even match, it's hardly more than that - and what's more, it'll be annoying them too. In an uneven match, say if we're getting dominated, the ice is going to screw the team over if we're retreating - but if we're getting dominated that badly, then it's either 1) the team playing worse than usual, or 2) the build not working. Neither has anything to do with the hall.

Kaiser, you mentioned that "all of our most memorable losses have happened there." I wasn't there for most of them, but I've been on the map with HLR a few times - and the losses we encountered, I would suggest it on a few possible things:
1) The opposing team outplaying us,
2) Build issues, or (and I think this is the most likely)
3) Unfamiliarity with the hall. Yes, everyone's played on it, everyone remembers it... but to play on Frozen requires different tactics and a different mindset. Frankly, I think that we may just have had trouble adapting to it quickly, and by that time - they were dominating us, and the game was over.

And that's what brings me to what I do like about Frozen, besides the fact that it's the best split hall currently offered. It's very easy to dominate in this hall. Once you get a clear advantage, it's easy to keep it, and it caters to a more "offensive" style of playing. I remember from my old matches that when we went to the flag stand, they managed to push us onto the ice. Once that turned into a retreat, they began to very quickly dominate us. With DP so early on in the game, it wasn't very happy.

The problems that we've had with Frozen before... can be turned on them with a little more practice, at least in my opinion. Of course, I'll play no matter what hall it is - but I still rest my case by Frozen.

[Kaiser]

If it comes down to "practice will make it so we can turn it against them," then I can turn that around and say, "practice will make it so that we don't have to rely on the map to win games for us." Then we can choose any map other than frozen.

[Liadan]

That's not what I'm trying to say at all, Kaiser. I'm saying that if we're going to run split builds, we go for Frozen, simply because of those tactical advantages. Honestly, I have a preference for 8v8 halls myself, but if we're going to run split halls now - why not use the best hall for it?

[Jupiter]

So, lets go snowy for at least the first weekend in December (maybe the month?)! And I'm toying with suggesting we Christmasify our capes but I'm afraid we won't get back to our exact cape afterwards. Sorry, waaay off topic.